[mkgmap-dev] Amenity=shelter

Sat Jan 15 19:54:53 GMT 2011

Hi Peter,

On Sat, Jan 15, 2011 at 06:12:20PM +0700, Peter Hendricks wrote:
>Hi again,
>
>Thanks for your response.
>
>On 5/01/2011 04:38, Marko Mäkelä wrote:
>> Sorry for the late reply.
>>
>> On Mon, Dec 06, 2010 at 07:47:21AM +1300, Peter Hendricks wrote:
>>> I see where this is coming from. The problem is that there are other 
>>> shelters, like roadside shelters that have nothing to do with buses.  
>>> Like this one:
>>>
>>> http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/80909803
>>>
>>> It's a lay-by with gas, food, etc. and there is a shelter from sun 
>>> and rain. Nothing to do with mountains or hiking. Perhaps this needs 
>>> to be tagged differently, but in any case, even a mountain shelter 
>>> shouldn't show up on the map as a campground. Perhaps 0x6402 
>>> building would be more appropriate? Label=shelter as well?
>>
>> What about tourism=picnic_site, fireplace=yes, covered=yes? The 
>> default style already translates it into 0x4a00.
>
>I don't know what to say to this. I didn't create the node, or indeed 
>the whole rest area. Thailand is full of roadside shelters, usually 
>quaint wooden constructions and I can see how anybody who wants to tag 
>one would use shelter, as there is no other obvious choice, certainly 
>not in JOSM.

You have to bear with me, as I am not a native speaker.

What is the typical usage scenario of the shelter? Is it for protecting 
goods, or for protecting people? There are used to be some 'milk 
shelters' in the Finnish countryside. Farmers would move milk the cows 
and place the milk in large metal vessels in a roadside shelter, where 
the milk truck would pick them up. Nowadays the farms are much larger 
and the truck fetches the milk directly from a tank at the farm. I do 
not know if any tagging practice exists for these largely disused 
features, but if one exists, might it be applicable?

>>I saw some tourism=lean_to
>
>tourism= is not an obvious choice, as most shelters have nothing to do 
>with tourism. Also, a lean-to is something attached to another 
>building, as the name suggests.

According to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lean-to the word has two 
meanings. In the woods, there usually is no building that the structure 
would lean to. I have seen two types of lean-to in the Finnish woods: a 
fixed (wooden one) and a temporary one, somewhat similar to a tent. Only 
the fixed ones would be tagged as tourism=lean_to, I believe.

>In any case, amenity=shelter in the img file becomes "Unknown type 
>(0x2b05, point)" in GPSMapEdit. Why in the map this becomes a camp 
>ground is beyond me, but it's a bug.

To me it would seem to be a bug or omission in GPSMapEdit. It is Garmin 
who defines the meanings of the codes, not some third-party software 
author.

I am sorry that I cannot provide an immediate fix to this. Living in a 
different part of the world, I am not familiar with this concept. Once 
you have a clear suggestion (maybe something that has been discussed on 
the tagging mailing list), I am happy to do something.

>>> Incidentally, the area highway=services on the GPS map turns into a 
>>> POI "Exit Unknown" with an interesting properties page. Check it out 
>>> @ N14.85751 E100.09283
>>
>> This is probably because you are using add-pois-to-areas.
>
>I think you are correct here (Lambertus certainly does), although the 
>POI should be something more intelligent.

The POI for the highway=services could be inappropriate. Are there any 
significant amounts of highway=motorway_junction that are tagged as 
highway=services? If not, we should probably remove the highway=services 
from the POI translation. The existing translations for amenity=fuel and 
shop=* should cover the road-side services, after all.

Best regards,

	Marko